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to answer your question about network versus local television as to which it should be, or which would be the better for disseminating information. My answer is that both should be involved. I think they can do different jobs, just as entertainment vehicles can do a different job

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than a public information campaign, the network by nature of having to reach across the coast. The breath of the country, I think, has to be more circumspect because they are talking to a larger, broader audience. And what local television can do is hone in on the

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particular issues that it faces in its community and local TV stations understand those communities better and how to speak to them. I manage a station in San Francisco. A few years ago, I managed to station in Pittsburgh. The approach that might be taken in some of

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the programming or in some of the language would be very different for those two places. They're both in the United States. They both need information. They both marketplaces want information. All of our research has shown that, but they want to hear it differently, and yet they

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want accurate and fairly specific information. Just carry out the maybe, actually getting deeply involved in this city. I'm sorry that your suggestion for a national conference for people in the media on AIDS I think it's an excellent idea and should probably be more than a one

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time event. And, uh, I think that if, in addition, some dimensions of human sexuality are included, it might even be able to help some of the entertainment media to without making their sexual episodes boring, perhaps introduce a little more depth than responsibility. Somewhere along the line,

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that's not always easy to do. I your suggestion raised to mind, perhaps, the way that, uh, such a conference and Dr Broder's organization could communicate. Because I know that as media people try to interpret medical ease or even talked with physicians who haven't learned somehow how

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to speak English in the way that can reach the general public, it's nice to have an interpreter. And one of the things I wanted to ask you, Dr Broder, is, um, the request was made in a treasury or national secretary, as I said so that we

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aren't doing all the things that we're capable of doing. Certainly that we would like to do. But one of the things I've managed to do in a few months I've been president is to get a number of organizations to receive the mailing list of all of

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the doctors. Now hope that the some of the major groups aren't you lean in his walk with your doctor group. We have not gotten C. D. C yet on that in that mailing list group, but we will M D. Anderson Hospital is giving us cancer information,

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and the answer is a resolute Yes, we would like to have a number of organizations that are concerned about health in any way sending US releases. And I've asked them if they wouldn't mind simply because even though we are, in a sense, medical writers, I suppose

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we right material. We would like it if they sent us some 32nd, uh, 6900 and 22nd material that we could scratch around to make a lot easier first, and we'd love to do it, and I pledge that we will put it on the air for you

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so you could triage, put it on the air to produce it. If you have the resources to do that, uh, I think that you're being too modest about this little country organization. Perhaps you could share approximately how wide a population the 70 physicians reach across the

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nation just to give some idea of the scope of the physicians who are filtering all this data through the news. Interesting that Charlie Fentress, a partner of mine, associate and other matters, said to me today, You'd better be prepared to tell them just how many people

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you reach on a weekly basis. And I said, Charlie, I have no idea. But it's It's literally millions, my own broadcast on camera X radio. You extrapolate that across the 70 doctors in the country and the fact that some of the material is replayed, uh, you

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know, they that evening and so on, I'd have to guess in the millions, but I just don't know. But I do know that you don't know, and I don't think Dr French on those now Doctor Bill Walsh knows for sure whether or not it is transmissible

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or contagious. If there's an AIDS virus in the saliva, particularly if someone has just freshly brushed their teeth as they might well, these that if you get it. The chances are it's 100%. And so my question is that you see if there's any doubt that's pretty

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certain. But I'm not sure about what has been referred to as French kissing. Well, I mean, in fact, many, many people will will say there's a difference between salivary contact, meaning if somebody saliva droplets lands on your chin, Um, from French kissing because there are differential

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degrees of its time, you think it is important point out that despite many attempts to positively identify transmission by saliva, that with all the thousands of cases throughout the world need to. So I think it's this. These are the kind of things that I think become

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very important. We had this expose in the paper about early identification of neurological damage. By the time that gets through the system before competent scientific authority can come before you know that we just don't have compelling evidence anywhere that we can do that, and we haven't

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seen this study. We don't know how valid the data is or the Cosmopolitan magazine article on recently, and not to worry women. Heterosexual transport just can't happen, uh, to you and so immediately on Nightline. Fortunately, they put it in the context, the proper context because it

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was refuted. I think that the fanning of fires of way becomes critical to the national education process. Anything we do. So my message the other day to the group of people at the National Press Club make sure and I think it's been extremely responsible. I have

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to say that I think in this case I have never seen reporting in any of the media electronic and otherwise there's been more responsible enhancing this one. I think there is a concern by those that are close to it and the people I deal with the

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there have had an opportunity to meet in the written media, For example. They're experts, they're good at it and they know what's right and wrong. And so they write well, and I think the electronic media has been the same way and they've been very sensitive to

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to for them to be subliminally uh, moving people towards a an environment that may enhance AIDS. I think that that concept is extremely beneficial for the country, so I think it's the way we present things becomes important. Are we really in the back of our minds,

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trying to tell people that there should be fear about alternatives. Or are we trying to say this is what we know now? This is what we don't know and allow them to make decisions. And I think it's the way we say that becomes very critical. I

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chime in on this because it's come up so many times, and I'm just delighted, Doctor. The function of the CDC's clearinghouses being developed now as one of the mechanism, is that the right the linkage for central clearinghouse so that people can begin to say, What is

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the what's the scientific validity of this, uh, study that's come out of a group of a small group of scientists here, or perhaps the one in a foreign country or something? It's just at least a cross check, or at least to be able to put it

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in the context of maybe an emerging new theory that's being worked by the National Institute of Health or or Mental Health or something like that, or National Science Institute are Cancer Institute, or perhaps something that can be checked through the Institute of Medicine. It just seems

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to me that that network that exchange data before something is put out. Uh, even with the unknowns and even with the caveat there tends to, it tends to flow through the country like wildfire. Uh, and, uh, and if we secondary anxious about something, you've got to

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give them an outlet. You've got to give them a place to go. That's why the linkage with community based organizations is so important. If people are concerned, if they can't get enough information from the media, and the media probably can't give them enough information that's explicit

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and tailored to their needs, we've got to have the resources to send the other point. I wanted to make impressed with what's been outlined as a level of commitment and a level of interest. Maybe it's the hour of the day, but I'm being the designated skeptic

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here about the question of whether that is sustainable longer than one season of television shows in which every primetime show does one show on AIDS and one show on drug abuse. And then off we go. And the advertisers never changed the imagery that they put in

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the ads, and it seems to me we've heard over and over again. This has got to be sustained, and it's got to be coordinated. So my question is, can you give us some reasonably specific ideas of what the community as a whole or units within the

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community could do to sustain the media industries in this shift that we see happening in the short term? What could we do to convert it into a real long term change? It is sustainable. Our experience has shown that, um, the campaign has been going on for

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four years, and we had to ask ourselves, you know, is it enough already? And what we found out is that the audience didn't think that it was because of things you will have brought up, that there's the latest rumor that makes it cycle again. No matter

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how many times you bring up the mosquito issue and think you've answered it, it comes back a couple of months later. Um, it is very difficult task to do one because of the uncertainty, the fear it's sustainable. If there is, I believe, a network and integration

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between the organizations in the community and between an organ or a panel like this, and the media we've been able to sustain it because we've had the support, the time, the energy and even in some cases putting money behind it from AIDS prevented prevention organizations such

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as amfAR and uh, San Francisco AIDS Foundation, we could not have made up a brochure ourselves that gave out specific information. We're not expert. They were able to do that for us. We were able to pay the printing and also then we have the outlet to

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say this is available right in Go get it, um and then they could address some other communities that maybe we can't reach, particularly through public service announcements and news. The I V drug user. That's a very difficult community to reach, and we're working to try to

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discover some things like that. So I think that if you get the cooperation, it's sustainable because we can produce the programs, we can produce the brochures. What we can't do is keep up with the information alone. That's really that's why we've been able to sustain it

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for four years and now have made a nationwide commitment for a year because we have these organizations working with us and we've had sponsors who've signed up recently advertisers. But some have been with us from the beginning, such as Chevron in San Francisco, so that we

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aren't bearing the total cost of it, be it in people time or in my were being supported. Um, I agree Dr Walsh, and brought up the specific examples of how information can be distributed to the media. One is locally the San Francisco AIDS Foundation. I'm sure

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there are other groups and other communities. Puts out a media alert with information, updated information that's proven to be very useful. They also are very available to us. While it's not an official media hotline at almost, I'm sure they feel it is such and in in

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October, during, uh, AIDS awareness, the C. D. C mailing of information and events and so forth was very helpful. So I think on a consistent basis that does need to happen. Is that continued Between that, uh, you talked about? I'm not the San Francisco AIDS Foundation?

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Yes. I don't think the C. D. C. Has continued. I'm not sure that I don't think I've seen it since it was. You have an idea of what, uh, what an information flow or exchange might be from your vantage point, uh, where you might see a

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need to, you know, here we had today guilty National AIDS Network coupled up with 300 different entities nationwide. We have so many national groups now. The AIDS Action Council itself is in the 50 states with all the variety of organizations. And there there are certain there's

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certain networking potential there for for the right to contact points. And then we need obviously need one from national authorities that can get into the latest the front edge of technology and answer some questions that much as I brought up with the early neurological damage identification.

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And so these are the kind of things that from your vantage point, what are you missing? What are the voids and the information flow that you'd like to see Harden up a little bit just flowing to you, not directing, which is giving you information? Do you

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have some ideas of how that might be enhanced? Let's say federal and then state, maybe from public health standpoint. If that isn't in your linkage now, and something that might be conceptually useful to for us to recommend a much more aggressive action to pull that together.

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I'd like to give that some more thought and give it to you in writing if you do it. But I think the C D. C model in October is the beginning. A place that I would look and and use that example as a starting point. Am

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I on your I I saw the light. Sure, Yeah. When we first uh, outlined our work, the media, what they could do for us is listed very, very, very prominently under our education section. I think with your industry, because it would do us a hell of

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a lot of good. It would do the cause a hell of a lot of good. It would do all these people in the panel before us, a terrific amount of good. And I think we're a little bit unsure about the mechanism. I'd suggest that there probably

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a several ways to interface, I think certainly the kind of task force that's been described here to take part in that would be useful. I think it would be very useful to have, and this is from a local television. In a news gathering point of view,

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some hotline or some designated authorities who would be available on both the national and a local, um, level to answer questions to dispel the current rumor once again and give us the precise information. That would be terrific. We could possibly if we could, you know how

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we started off okay with it all coming down. And if that's stopped now and if we could work with the media here, it would be I think it would be a terrific plus myself. And I do believe the task force and seminars, be it on a

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regional or on the national level. Um, and urging by this panel for broadcasters to attend from the executive office itself could be very useful in getting those broadcasters who have not yet, um, signed up, so to speak. There was a recent