00:00:01.340 - 00:00:25.360

Yeah. Yeah. Well I was surprised that it happened to san Francisco. I suspected it would happen across the bay in Oakland. It was a disappointing thing and it happened in this city, but it's happening all across the country and I guess we have to do something

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about it. What do you think ought to be there? And that's a big broad question. And uh I don't know if we have enough time to talk all about all of it, but I think the basic problem is that the people of the city have to

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be educated to the point that uh they can help these people. And uh some of the city officials have to be educated to the point where they can step in and do something about the problem and get to the heart of the problem, which is probably

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unemployment. Do you think that the riots affected you personally as a citizen? Um indirectly, not in my personal life, but uh it started the whole chain of reaction of talking about the civil rights movement in our country, and indirectly, it did affect me. Is there a

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great deal more talk about the problem now than there was before? And you think? I think as far as uh, my generation is concerned the younger people in business, uh, there's more stimulation about this problem in the city because it uh, it struck home it was

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closer to home. So I think there is more talk about him. Much has been done about the Hunters Point area and people out of jobs and so on since september. Do you think Enough is being done? And is it effective? Well, um, I think there's more

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to be done. Uh, I feel I haven't seen any direct effect of it. I haven't seen any direct results I hear, and I read in the newspaper that things are being done, but I haven't seen anything. And I think there, uh, there should be more evidence

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signs so that the people of the city can get behind this thing more. How do you think that people should be educated to know that these things are or are not happening? Well, through the mass media of what you're doing right now and through newspapers and,

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uhh, this type of thing. Have you ever been to Hunter's Point? Yes, I have. I've driven through there and I've never stayed there or, uh, uh, participated in anything there, but I've drove through the place. Thank you. The riots happened in september. Have you kept pace

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with what's been happening in Hunter's point about Hunter's point? Since then, I read about it as it goes along, I certainly can say that I'm not in accord with the people who are doing the riots and the fact that they're doing picketing against our men. Men,

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supplies must be sent to them. These things I feel very strongly about because I was in the last war and also in the korean war. I'd hate to think that any time we got into a position we're in today, that uh, the supplies that we absolutely

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have to have to carry on the fight that we're trying to do would be big of not given to us are kept us from getting by people who are doing such things as they are doing. What do you think caused the disturbances at Hunter's point in

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september? I have really could never put my finger on it. Uhh, it's really a mystery. I mean, this is like a lot of other things that go on in a group of people that the centers of in anything, whether it's war or if they didn't have

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that, they'd probably be fighting against something else. Well, there's been an awful lot of talk, an awful lot written and good many programs designed to help the people at hunters point. And you kept touch with those and you believe that they're working. I haven't kept in

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real good close touch with it. And I don't know a great deal about it the little that I've have heard, which seemed to me that um, not enough is really being done and maybe we're not going about it the right way. Uh Yes, certainly true that

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these people are underprivileged and that they don't have the chances to get along that other people do or that the average person does. But we have to remember that they have grown in numbers more rapidly than they could be taken care of. And sometimes these people

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who have a chance to better themselves, as far as an education is concerned, really aren't interested in pursuing it. They think that they should step in and to a high paying job And I'm for it, I'd like for him to have a high paying job. But

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after all, you can't pay a man $150 $200 a week if he's not able to produce or capable of doing the thinking that will make somebody else do the producing for him, whose responsibility do you feel it is to either help the people at Hunter's Point

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or help underprivileged people generally? It's the citizens themselves. I mean, they have a chance to do what the government in itself can't really do. I mean if everyone, this is the thing that it's like a if all of a sudden we found out that there's someone

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whose house has burned down and he's been a good citizen, We all buying together and try to do something to promote home and furniture and clothing and food for these people until something better can be done for them. Do you feel that the riots affected your

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life person? Not really. I think it really has affected everyone in a little way, but not to any extent where it would um, make us change our way of living. In other words, we're pretty hard to touch, you know, I mean, they takes a real shock

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in the pants to make us get up and do something. You mean the rights themselves? Yes. This this of course was a starter and the ball was picked up somewhere along the way. I think it might have been fumbled and someone else has got to step

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in and pick it up. Now, this is a chance for our newly elected governor, Reagan too sure what he's made out of and what he can do. You think his approach will be significantly different than government grounds was? I don't know how it could be, but

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his young blood and he has a lot of he says young men around him with new ideas now would be the time from to come forth. It was something really constructive. Thank you very much. Thank you. Do you think the situation is Hunters? Hunters Point has

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changed much since the riots in september? Well, I honestly don't know. I don't believe so. What makes you think that? It hasn't? Well, I've heard nothing constructive about the results. Either way. I believe everything is still stagnant still the same. You know, of any programs that

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have been initiated? No, I don't. There have been several poverty programs started. And do you know much about the poverty program itself in the Bay Area? Not enough to talk about right at all. Have you ever been to Hunter's Point? Yes. Once was that before or

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after The right before? Two years ago. Did the riots affect you or your life? No at all. Has your feelings towards minorities change? Since On his point. A good question. Mhm. I would say yes, but I'd rather not give an answer until I really know more

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about it. I definitely think I do. I believe in the minorities. I believe something should be done about it, but I don't know what and whose responsibility do you feel that is to do something? I believe firstly, the state and secondly, the city and of course,

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well, I should say first the government should do something about it. That's the first step. The second step would be the state. Thank you very much. You very well, moving to the southern edge of the city, we asked many of the same questions in the Stones

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town mall. How do you feel now about what happened at Hunters Point and Bayview last september? Well, I think Hunter's point at people there that started this riot in the outcome of this policeman shooting this boy in my place. If I was the placement in looking

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with the situation with this boy, I don't know if, I don't know if I get a shot. The boy like that or not actually. The policeman I think was in the right in shooting, but not, I'm sure the policeman didn't intend on killing the boy and

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myself. I don't know what I'd have done if I'd have been in his shoes, but It's 100 points sits right now. I think that the people in the white community should look at this place and go out there and look at how these people are living

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in these conditions. They're living in out there right now uh myself, I can't see how a person could live in those conditions that the way they are, there's a responsibility. Do you feel uh, is for improvement? Who's, who's responsible for improving the situation, improving the situation

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out there? I feel that the mayor of san Francisco should look into this out there right now because I don't know, he seems like he wants to step away from the situation when it comes right to his face, he wants to step back from it the

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way I look at it. Do you know of any positive projects that have started in Hunter's Point since september that are working well there after since the riot. They're got these jobs opportunities for these uh, for the colored people out there. But uh, it seems like

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most of these people out there just don't want to take. I noticed in the paper that they had over 300 positions filled out of better than I think it said 1500 jobs. And to me yet, people out there just don't want to, they don't look like

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they don't want to work. They want to cause a riot, but they don't want to work. I don't know what the riot was all about in the first place, because they they just don't want to get out and work. Like, I guess the white people do.

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That's the way I look at it. Were you personally affected by what happened out there in september uh, business wise? Yes. In what way? Uh, I would say our business was after the riots. Just about 1/4 off since the riots. What kind of business are you

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in your business? I think. Um whose responsibility other than the mayor's, do you feel it is to improve conditions in places like Hunters Point? Uh Well, I think the people of san Francisco are at fault because of this riot. Also, do you think another riot as

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possible? I think so, yes. Have you ever been to Hunter's Point? Yes, I have. I've seen the way people live out there, and to me that's not living. If you were to advise the white majority of san Francisco, what to do about Hunter's Point now, what

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would you say? Well, I'm not at right now, I'm not to say because I'm not you might say the supreme white ruler. I'm not I can't say yes or no on that. Thank you. If you could give advice to the citizens of san Francisco about what

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to do about situations like Hunters Point, what would it be? What would it be? Mhm. I would say that every uh well from an example I'd say walking into stores right now of the owners and the people who work there should be a little more pleasant

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to the negro people who come in there because um as a victim of this, I'm coming to me in the stores and right away there's a people following you around and right away you get that feeling that you're trying to steal and you know that you

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aren't. So I feel that if if everyone was just a little friendlier and more trusting, I think this would be the situation would. Uh So these now, thank you. How do you feel now about the Hunters Point riots of two months ago? I feel that the

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riots served a purpose to inform the public that there's a lot of depression and a lot of people who are not getting the privilege of a good education or job opportunities. But I don't think things have changed very much since the riots. In what way? I

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don't think the job opportunities that were offered have really come about. I think a lot of people are still in need of jobs desperately in Hunter's Point. And I don't think the housing situation has changed very dramatically there. I think that people need to be given

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more opportunity and Hunters point to expand and get a good education. You think the civil rights movement generally is asking too much wanting to move too fast? I don't think they're asking too much. I think they're asking for equal privileges. They may be moving a little

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too fast for the country at this point, but I don't think they're asking for too much. Whose responsibility is it in your opinion to improve conditions at a place like Hunters point? I think it's the responsibility of all the people in the city and the people

00:13:42.400 - 00:14:02.850

in the country. Our aftermath camera team moved next to san Francisco's Mission district. Well there everybody is entitled to work in. A lot of people say that it's because of their race and all that that they don't work. But now that they do have jobs, a

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lot of them that do have jobs now and want the money but they don't want to work for. Do you know of any any projects that are going on at Hunter's Point designed to improve the people and do you know if they're working or not? No,

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I don't. I know of the post office when they hired all the poverty stricken areas. You know when I know a man have your own feelings towards racial minorities changed since the riots? In september? No. What were they? I'd rather not say. Okay, thank you. Have

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your own feelings about racial minorities changed any since september? No. Well, where they then? Well, you know, anybody that's good to me, I'm good to them. I don't care what color they are. It doesn't make any difference. So after it was how do you feel now

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about what happened at Hunter's Point? Last september? Oh, I don't feel that it was a good idea at all for the policemen to shoot the boy. I don't think it was necessary at all because he was too young. Do you think that's what caused what happened

00:15:08.700 - 00:15:25.510

there? Yes, I do in a sense, this is what caused it because you know, the heat I believe has something to do with it because you know, anytime that's hot weather, people are always kind of frigid and excited and I think this has something to do

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with it. Also. Do you think the other complaints about jobs and housing and lack of education had anything to do with what happened? Yes, I do. Because a lot of kids hang around because they had no jobs and they didn't have anything to do. So naturally.

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They would idle idle minds make devil's workshop. So I always say so if these Children, teenagers, adults had anything to do, then this wouldn't cause riots and lollygagging around on the streets. Perhaps. Do you have any idea if things have changed significantly at Hunter's point since

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then? Well, it's quieter. I can say that it is quieter. Have living conditions changed anything? Well, in some areas, yes, they have changed. Do you feel that the civil rights movement has has achieved a great deal over the past few years? While some what it has

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achieved somewhat, but not completely, Where do you think it ought to be now? Well, if they had more jobs and more opportunities to take Children off the streets and they had more parents to take a little more interested in their Children to have more recreation centers

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than it would be. More changes made. Was your own life affected at all by the disturbances at Hunter's point? No, I was worried about it naturally. I was upset about the boy because I didn't know his parents and it was kind of upsetting. But these things

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happen. What do you think is really responsible for improving things? What the boy you mean for improving situations like the area? Well, I believe me and Shelly could help quite a bit. You know, if they would just have more uh talking with different community groups, different

00:17:14.770 - 00:17:31.800

uh N A. C. P groups, maybe the core and go into the communities to school to really find out what happens and know how these people feel. Not just say, well just well think about it next time you see, but you have to really get to

00:17:31.800 - 00:17:44.690

the background of this thing. In fact myself, I would like to work with this type of group. I really think I could help. I really do. But until then you've got to have a group of people that will sit down and talk about this type of

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thing. And I'd say we'll take care of this next week next year. You gotta work on it now because this is when the things start, you just can't put people in the background and say, well, you know, we'll do this next year, you come back next

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week, you gotta do it now. I mean it takes time I realized this you know but you really got to think about these things. What does the term black power mean to you? Well I think it's just a group that they have got up themselves. You

00:18:13.250 - 00:18:28.490

know? I mean it doesn't mean I mean I have talked to some of these people which are called Muslims and what have you. But black power really doesn't mean that the black negro person wants to rule the world. This means unity. This is the way they

00:18:28.490 - 00:18:46.150

feel that each man, each negro man, each negro woman can walk with dignity with their heads high and not be put in a category of being a negro. I mean if they have a feel they want to be an engineer, a nurse, doctor, but not be

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specified as a negro doctor, a negro teacher. But what you can do this is what means a lot to a negro person, right? What you can do not an individual, everybody's an individual. But you want to know about what I can do and how can perform

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this job. But okay, goodbye. How do you now feel about what happened at Hunter's Point? Last september? Well, I feel personally it was a tragedy for all the people involved um for the city, I think it's just another one of the warnings that they're getting and

00:19:20.750 - 00:19:37.510

ignoring. Do you think the warnings are still being ignored as a woman in the street? I don't really seem to see much effective progress. I've lived here for almost four years now and I've been visiting the city for almost 11 or 12 and I don't think

00:19:37.510 - 00:19:53.090

it's a unique problem to san Francisco, but I don't feel that anybody is really doing anything to solve it. What do you think should do something to solve it? Mm. That's a hard question to answer. Quite right. You know, if the war on poverty for instance

00:19:53.090 - 00:20:11.670

is working effectively in areas like Hunters Point, well, I know what friends of mine say, who are either involved in that or well, who are on the poverty level and that they don't feel too impressed, they feel is lacking direct action. Some kind a lot of

00:20:11.680 - 00:20:29.420

talk, a lot of fine things being said, a lot of people running around having meetings, nothing happening. It's sort of like the Russians proverb, that bazaar is very generous, but the money comes through many sieves. Do you feel that you were personally involved in what happened

00:20:29.420 - 00:20:51.850

last september in Hunter's point? Yeah. In what way? Just as a human being? If somebody maybe who didn't do something when I might have done something, you think that the civil rights movement itself is trying to achieve its ends too soon or too fast. It's not

00:20:51.850 - 00:21:12.440

that simple. Uhh, you know, civil rights movement is long overdue. On the other hand, the kind of repression and stuff that went on for the last 100 years since the civil war couldn't continue either. So we have violence, meeting violence. Do you think there's a possibility

00:21:12.440 - 00:21:33.360

of another happening as last september's Sure, tomorrow next week, next month. Any time if you had any advice to give to the people of san Francisco the citizens about a situation like that, what would it be? You can't wait for the other guy to do it.

00:21:34.640 - 00:21:50.810

You've got to take action yourself. You've got to decide where you stand and then you've got to try and do what you can. What do you think? Ordinary human being citizens can do? Well, we can some of us try and straighten out our own thinking about

00:21:50.820 - 00:22:07.500

things like this. It's not really happening to the other guy or to those people that we don't know over there. It is happening to us. Do you? And to your Children to mine. We can try to do what we can for our own neighbor, our own

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family and try not to get any other guys way. Do you live in an integrated neighborhood around the corner here? I guess so. Have you ever been to Hunter's Point? Yeah. Since september No, I haven't. I'm a little afraid to go out there. Why look at

00:22:29.370 - 00:22:50.040

me? That's one reason. Um yeah, I represent something and they represent something and you can't ignore that. It's the same. Like I don't think any white person is too happy to go down in the fillmore anymore and they got good reason to be afraid of. You

00:22:50.040 - 00:23:07.350

think that a meaningful dialogue between whites and blacks as possible in this city like san Francisco at this stage of things. I don't I'm not to encourage anymore. Is there any other way then to achieve what a meaningful dialogue would hope to achieve? I'm not too

00:23:07.350 - 00:23:24.870

sure what a meaningful dialogue means. It means. I believe what it means to me is that whites and blacks will sit down and talk to each other, Consider the problem as being theirs, not ours. Mhm. And make something happen out of it. Something good. There's a

00:23:24.870 - 00:23:45.350

lot of talking by these people. I think maybe the basic mistake is trying to say when those whites and these black sit down because it's not that easy. It's when the people decide to sit down and work out a solution that will get somewhere, not as

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long as it's them on ice.